What do you think? Who was at fault? Jorg or Jan?

[311unity13B]

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=4CBeuoJmZ7g#noexternalembed

[racerboyadam]

As much as I like Corvette, I place the blame on Jan.  Without the move down pit lane for the lead, he likely would have been able to pass at another point safely.  That being said- Same Place, Same Time, I would have done the same thing. 

[BillBones]

Both Corvettes seemed to be doing a lot of banging into other cars at Laguna Seca.  Gavin hit 5 cars with one move an hour into the race.  Beretta hit Dyson's Mazda right front to left rear of the Mazda, knocking the Mazda  out.

With 1:37 left to go, O'Connel passed Westbrook in the VICI Porsche by pushing the Porsche off the track on exit.  On the final turn of the last lap, Magnusen hit Bergmeister in the FLM Porsche at apex, freeing it up.  If you're going to start banging into people, you had better be prepared to have it end in the way it did.

Glad to hear Jan was OK.

 

[311unity13B]

Yeah, I dont get why Corvette was going crazy bumping people all over the place.  You can argue its "just racing" but that's NASCAR crap.

[BillBones]

Maybe the Corvette team was trying to send a message to everyone else in GT2: "Get ready, we're coming hard next year."

I hope the stewards send a message to Corvette: Race cleanly

[amazing]

What do I think?
Joerg is a non driver!
Flying Assholes are already out classed by P&M.
WHEN YOU ARE 1 1/2 SECONDS SLOWER A LAP,DO NOT BE AN ASSHOLE BY TRYING TO BLOCK A CAR THAT IS OBVIOUSLY WAY FASTER THAN YOU WILL EVER BE!

If you dont like this !

FUCK OFF !

[BillBones]

Someone made a video of the incident, first at real speed, second at half, then at quarter speed.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=LrLKbZcL3TA

[BillBones]

WHEN YOU ARE 1 1/2 SECONDS SLOWER A LAP...

Best lap of #3 Corvette: 1:23.963 on lap 137 of 155, Mags driving.
Best lap of #45 Porsche: 1:24.193 on lap 131 of 155, Joerg driving.

http://imsaracing.net/2009/events/laguna/results/Final%20Race%20ALMS%20Laguna%20REV.pdf

[leeself]

ok how bout these:

picture 1, through the last corner, porsche nose clean and undamaged


here is a shot of the same nose, immedietly after the race, oh look damage to the nose.
wonder if he hit him or not?


-Lee

[leeself]

WHEN YOU ARE 1 1/2 SECONDS SLOWER A LAP...

Best lap of #3 Corvette: 1:23.963 on lap 137 of 155, Mags driving.
Best lap of #45 Porsche: 1:24.193 on lap 131 of 155, Joerg driving.

http://imsaracing.net/2009/events/laguna/results/Final%20Race%20ALMS%20Laguna%20REV.pdf

Bill, c'mon you watched it, end of the race, Jorgs tires are gone,
Jan has saved his for the charge at the end. Jan chased him down at the end
by being more than a second a lap faster at that time.

-Lee

[MiCarr]

Some Damn Good and Exciting Raceing!!!!!  No matter which side of the fence your on...   
.




Mags had him...

[GGoose]

Jan driving the heavier car should have never allowed himself to be picked that way, the Lizard ran him out to the wall but when they got door to door Jan absolutely should have moved him back towards track center forcibly. Lizard boy was quite feisty due to Jan ramming him in the ass at the last corner so Janni Mags should have expected what was coming and not put the car in a situation that he couldn't do anything about........ Sebring should be interesting to say the least, paybacks are HELL!

[SACK-U]

Look at this thread: they have pics of exactly how for the vette was in front: http://www.digitalcorvettes.com/forums/showthread.php?t=129258

[Misplaced Floridian]

I've posted this elsewhere, but will say it here too:  Jorg was probably remembering T17 in Sebring 2007 - the last lap battle he had with Jaime Melo.  Jamie got the inside, pushed Jorg out who backed off and as a result lost.  This time, Jan was to the inside but clearly ahead - so Jorg played a little dirty pool, pushed out and walled him.  Wasn't sure until Sack just posted his pics and links - fairly obvious from those that Jorg was clearly at fault.

In the on-line league where I race, if one driver had done that to another he'd have been penalized at the end of the race and the win taken away.

[BillBones]

It appears that both drivers have been suspended for two races, to be served in 2010.

http://lastturnclub.com/index.php?option=com_content&task=view&id=659&Itemid=49

From Last Turn Club:

Throwing the Flag - or Not

The armchair drivers are in full chat across the net. Jan this, and Jörg that. Good, bad, even evil. Not hard to separate who’s for whom. The Porsche partisans predictably cast Magnussen as the villain, Corvette clubbers pretty sure that Bergmeister is the devil’s spawn.

Of course real racing is far more complex than the Nintendo crowd would have it. Over the years incident after incident has been a matter of debate, often between the same (predictable) partisans, and almost always without a clear conclusion. Bumping to the finish at Sebring, no call. A car turned at Sears Point, a penalty, then many years later at Road America, no call. An even more ambiguous bump at Mosport, a call. A rear-end bump of a competitor checking up – penalized. An admitted intentional punt, no call. Some of those instances were accelerating GT cars turned by GT cars, “rotational velocity” notwithstanding.

Where does a poor pass that puts two cars into the trap at the exit of Turn 9 rank in the pantheon of transgressions? Nowhere, it seems, even though it ended the race of a car we’ve thought is a crowd favorite. What about the unexpected turn-in that ended that fourteen lap chase at the front not long after halfway.

We debated the GT finish on a long drive home.  At least this contact was in a race for position, for all the marbles, as they say. That gives it something of an excuse, if not a reason, and makes it miles better than those careless punts by entrants not competing with each other, that are sometimes laps – or classes – apart.

 Was the banging through the corner avoidable contact? A judgment call, but probably. Someone observed, “the responsibility for a safe pass rests with the overtaking driver.” In the run to the flag, was that Bergmeister? Did Jörg take the Corvette toward the wall? Undoubtedly. Did he “turn” the Corvette? Possibly. An infraction? Most likely. So two flags. Both of the personal foul variety. Penalties offset. Too bad we can’t replay the down, but of course this being racing, not football, we can’t.

Were the actions of each great enough to merit a penalty? We think so, and so, apparently, does IMSA, who issued two race suspensions to each of them, to be served in 2010. We don’t like the idea of suspensions, for a number of reasons. First, they “duck” having to take a real and immediate action. Fine, but indecisiveness not what you pay race officials for. Second, since they are not immediate, they are not a deterrent to the behavior (any first-year psych major could explain why). If the behavior deserves a suspension, it deserves a penalty.
 
Finally, a suspension leaves a driver unable to race. What will constitute the “next” offense? Assume that a Challenge car (or any car) checks up in front of Jan or Jörg at Sebring? If they tag it, will they be suspended? Keep in mind something similar occurred with Tomas Enge (to this day, many very close to that situation believe Enge was unfairly treated, but defending him was politically untenable).
 
Following closely is part of racing, isn't it? Aren't we putting drivers in an impossible position?
 
If you believe there was an infraction at Laguna Seca, you enforce it. If not, you don't. A suspension is a "sidestep," passing it on to next year.

The right call? Here’s our idea (given to us in one of our many discussions since the event). Assess  Magnussen and Bergmeister each a 1 lap (plus) penalty. The effect of that? The winner is the Farnbacher Loles Porsche of Pierre Ehret and Wolf Henzler; PTG’s Panoz of Dominik Farnbacher and Ian James is runner-up. Bergmeister finishes third and Magnussen fourth.